Tue, 19 Dec 2023 04:46:21 +0000 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150567#Comment_150567 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150567#Comment_150567 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 10:34:38 +0100 tony
And what if it was function room for conferences, receptions, dining?]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150644#Comment_150644 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150644#Comment_150644 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 17:38:49 +0100 jamesingram So 4 x 14W T5 ( 4 x 18W T8) in 600/600 module or LED dimmerable 45W 600/600 modules
both can have additional emergency lighting backup modules added

as to function room etc. I'd say plenty of socket to allow for plug in lamps for variable task light
may be LED wall lights if the bugdet will allow]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150645#Comment_150645 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150645#Comment_150645 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 18:12:22 +0100 tony http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150646#Comment_150646 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150646#Comment_150646 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 18:58:38 +0100 barney
1 - what illuminance level do I need, can i meet that task lighting illuminance locally at the desk and avoid a high energy consuming general lighting system meeting that task lighting level everywhere - 500 lux and a cat 2 louvres is widely specified (still) and is a complete disaster from an energy perspective

2 - i would focus slightly less on the particular lumen package and more on the luminaire LOR - it's no good having a high performing lamp package if most of the light doesn't get out of the box - the metric should be the installed efficacy of the installation

3 - Daylight linking with dimmable control gear will give huge savings compared to comparisons between different luminaires

Do all three, and you should be able to show 80% savings over a "typical" office lighting scheme

Regards

Barney]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150647#Comment_150647 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150647#Comment_150647 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 19:30:07 +0100 tony http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150648#Comment_150648 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150648#Comment_150648 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 19:31:06 +0100 DamonHD
Rgds

Damon]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150659#Comment_150659 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150659#Comment_150659 Thu, 05 Jul 2012 20:43:06 +0100 HalcyonRichard I would also make sure the lights are switched in groups. This means if only a small part of the area is being used you don't have to have all the lights on. One office I worked in had this. I sat by the windows and always turned off my patch as I hate the flourescent glow/flicker. When one half of the office was turned over to storerage this half was usually turned off as well.

Richard]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150697#Comment_150697 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150697#Comment_150697 Fri, 06 Jul 2012 09:55:15 +0100 barney
Depending on how far you want to go with controls, I would use manual on with absence off - in small groups as above. If it's a rasonable sized office, you could also consider links to corridor hold etc to avoid lone workers sitting in a small pool of light in a generally dark space

Good daylight is important for many reasons - let alone the significant energy savings when integrated with the lighting solution - just beware of the need to control glare though - you really don't want to engineer in a "blinds down - lights on" scenario by making the space too "bright" for the users. (Equally, 1 w of solar energy in = 1w of cooling power needed - so the balance has to be the energy saved from daylight compared with the winter heat loss through glazing and the solar gain in summer)

Regards

Barney]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150701#Comment_150701 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150701#Comment_150701 Fri, 06 Jul 2012 10:11:25 +0100 RobinB Posted By: DamonHDI would like to see more of (3) with possible light piping from outside too: it offers a real saving when the sun is out like having solar PV but at probably a tiny fraction of the cost and space and complexity.


Does anyone think it realistic to use fibre optic cables to bring daylight into a building? I might be talking rubbish but it would be a nice alternative to those light tunnel things which I also like.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150703#Comment_150703 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150703#Comment_150703 Fri, 06 Jul 2012 10:21:02 +0100 fostertom http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150704#Comment_150704 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150704#Comment_150704 Fri, 06 Jul 2012 10:34:28 +0100 barney
It's not difficult - and modern mylar type wavelength attenuated reflective coatings make it even easier

Optic fibres can work, but as Tom pointed out, you need to concentrate the flux. I did see an experimental unit with 3M's which had a collector plate and a transmitter plate with optic fibre between - experimental and not very successsful - but I guess we could get there. No desire though I suspect - easier to put windows in !!

Regards

Barney]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150705#Comment_150705 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150705#Comment_150705 Fri, 06 Jul 2012 10:52:48 +0100 RobinB Posted By: fostertomThe cross sectional area of fibre optic would have to be at least as large as the light tunnel - more in fact! Unless light flux was mightily concentrated e.g. by fresnel lens, at the 'skylight' collection surface. It shocked me to discover how lossy fibre optic is, at piping light - I'd thought the whole point was that they were almost loss-less.

Ah I thought it might not be so simple. Someone on another thread (forget which) was mulling using fibre optics to shift light from a centralised, well cooled LED source and I thought if that would work then the same would go for daylight.

Could still be very pretty if not very efficient - but then daylight's for free..]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150707#Comment_150707 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=150707#Comment_150707 Fri, 06 Jul 2012 11:05:47 +0100 barney
As I mentioned, 3m's had a working version 20 years ago - but it addressed the problem of poor architecture or constaints imposed by deep plan sites - with better integration of daylight into building design we shouldn't need them.

Regards

Barney]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289535#Comment_289535 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289535#Comment_289535 Sun, 16 May 2021 22:35:47 +0100 Victorianeco
We are renting so don't want to spend too much but it has one light switch linked to 3 strip lights.

I know I won't recoup any expenditure but the lighting didn't seem 'the best'.

What sort of lights are available and controls without breaking the bank?]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289536#Comment_289536 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289536#Comment_289536 Mon, 17 May 2021 07:41:33 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Strip lights (flourescent tubes) are actually quite efficient in terms of lumens / Watt but they do fade over time so it might be worth changing the tubes - take care about the colour of light emitted, I find that the colder colours give better illumination.
Another option could be to disconnect 1 or 2 of the strip lights and get task lights (led of course) for the desks and you can take these with you when you leave. But this may not save much (if any) energy over the strip lights and could cost quite a bit.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289550#Comment_289550 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289550#Comment_289550 Mon, 17 May 2021 19:02:41 +0100 Victorianeco http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289554#Comment_289554 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289554#Comment_289554 Mon, 17 May 2021 20:21:36 +0100 djh edit: the fittings come with electronic ballasts as well.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289613#Comment_289613 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289613#Comment_289613 Tue, 18 May 2021 21:25:17 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289618#Comment_289618 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289618#Comment_289618 Wed, 19 May 2021 00:16:40 +0100 Victorianeco
I also read about circadian lighting that varies throughout the day]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289620#Comment_289620 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289620#Comment_289620 Wed, 19 May 2021 05:02:47 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289630#Comment_289630 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289630#Comment_289630 Wed, 19 May 2021 12:26:54 +0100 djh Posted By: Peter_in_HungaryIMO there will be no advantage either environmentally or financially in changing the fittings to modern ones over changing the tubes for new that are not worn out. A bit like swapping out CFL bulbs for leds before the CFLs fail.
I tend to agree with this - I still have CFL lamps in some fittings for that reason. AFAICT T5 fluorescent tubes are still more efficient than the LED equivalents. For T5 tubes I just buy the plain under-counter fittings used in kitchens, since they are way cheaper than anything else.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289633#Comment_289633 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289633#Comment_289633 Wed, 19 May 2021 13:30:56 +0100 Victorianeco
And if I just buy T5 fittings then surely they need to be fire rated etc being in a commercial setting?]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289636#Comment_289636 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289636#Comment_289636 Wed, 19 May 2021 13:46:52 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary
The best solution to an opaque diffuser is to remove it!

The best colour is the one with which you are happy]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289638#Comment_289638 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289638#Comment_289638 Wed, 19 May 2021 14:09:11 +0100 djh Posted By: Victorianecoidea on best colour spectrum to go with for an office then?
Personally, we like daylight (6500 K) and it blends well with real daylight if lights are used during the day.

But many UK people have been brought up with warm white (2700 K) and don't like what they think is cold daylight. For these I would recommend the strangely name 'cold daylight' (4000 K) as a compromise. I find it strange that these are called cold when they are 'warmer' than actual daylight.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289639#Comment_289639 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289639#Comment_289639 Wed, 19 May 2021 14:57:37 +0100 Ed Davies is colder than 6500 K ]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289642#Comment_289642 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289642#Comment_289642 Wed, 19 May 2021 16:40:03 +0100 djh Posted By: Ed DaviesBut 4000 Kiscolder than 6500 K
Yeah, yeah. And 2700 K is even colder. Weird, huh? ]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289649#Comment_289649 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289649#Comment_289649 Wed, 19 May 2021 22:31:23 +0100 WillInAberdeen
Or disco colours changing in time to the music, if you feel young enough.

We stuck some LED tape over the kitchen units of the house we rented temporarily, on the basis it was cheap enough to abandon when we moved out.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289692#Comment_289692 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289692#Comment_289692 Fri, 21 May 2021 18:27:32 +0100 Victorianeco http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289710#Comment_289710 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289710#Comment_289710 Sun, 23 May 2021 07:21:48 +0100 tony http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289711#Comment_289711 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=9294&Focus=289711#Comment_289711 Sun, 23 May 2021 07:54:44 +0100 tony
The ones in cupboard or boiler don’t need to be replaced as they will never save enough energy to pay for themselves. Any idea of payback cupboard 2x 10mins/day 5 days a week, boiler room 2 hours a year.]]>