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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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    • CommentAuthorcc64
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    Has anyone seen a copy of PAS2035? Looks like a great solution to a lot of woes, if only we could find the staff that could be relied upon to do a job...

    PAS2035 is understandably big on boundaries edges junctions of retrofit insulation. And this is focus of my query.

    Have retro fit of early 90s terrace apparently built by apprentices. External walls will have IWI applied. Question is whether to extend this down party walls. I don't really want to do that as the intent for party walls is to apply acoustic solutions so I don't hear quite so much of the neighbors.

    Block and brick. Party cavity 10cm will be rockwool filled. External cavity 10cm will be EPS bead filled. Blob and dob plasterboard will be stripped from all blockwork walls before application of IWI to external and acoustic to party walls.

    Question is do I need to extend insulation some distance down party wall to prevent thermal bypass of IWI on external wall.

    M
  1.  
    It's the ideal, to return IWI onto internal and party walls, to cloak the thermal bridge, but I see your point re acoustic, and you don't want to 'break' that. What will the acoustic treatment to the party wall (not the 'party cavity') be?

    I typically return IWI between 150 and 400mm, depending on the specific circumstances.

    What sort of IWI will you use? If, for example, you were using dense wood-fibre, that might (I don't know) contribute a bit to the sound-proofing on the 'return' anyway.
    • CommentAuthorcc64
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    Acoustic will be some laminate of acoustic plasterboard, these are usually 15mm, with layers of closed cell foam and mass loaded vinyl. With the possible exception of the foam non of these layers have a presentable thermal resistance. I've queried to the soundproofing store the lambda values for the foam and MLV they use (as their spec sheet quotes only for the plasterboard layer), but realize that nothing dense is going to be anything but thermally conductive.

    External wall IWI will be aerogel.

    Simply wonder whether the issue might best be addressed by extending a (thinner) aerogel layer down the party wall under the acoustic assembly. Its immobilized air content would contribute to acoustic objectives and obviously also to thermals.

    Probably need some PSI (?) figure calculations but where how to get those done; the software isn't exactly open acces
    • CommentAuthordathi
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    http://www.ili.co.uk/en/S.R.54-2014.pdf don't know if this one is of any use to you it the irish retrofit standards
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    Posted By: cc64Has anyone seen a copy of PAS2035

    Check to see if it's available through your local library. I find it very annoying that standards like this aren't freely available.

    Simply wonder whether the issue might best be addressed by extending a (thinner) aerogel layer down the party wall under the acoustic assembly. Its immobilized air content would contribute to acoustic objectives and obviously also to thermals.

    I can't see that that would cause any problems and it's simple. So go for it if you can accept the extra cost etc.

    Probably need some PSI (?) figure calculations but where how to get those done; the software isn't exactly open acces

    You mean psi values (Ψ) - thermal bridging calculations? If so, the go-to software is Therm and it's freely available.
    • CommentAuthorcc64
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    Interesting read. Thank you. From which I conclude that my insulated cavity party and external wall application of IWI probably does not warrant full depth extension of IWI down the party wall.
    • CommentAuthorbxman
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    Hi @cc64

    I have a pdf copy of

    "PAS 2030:2014 Edition 1
    Improving the energy efficiency of existing buildings
    Specification for installation process, process management and service provision "


    I suspect 2035 may be similar and not that much practical help.

    However if that would be of any use PM me and I can email it to you


    Have you a quote on the aerogel ?

    I would like to try it in some places but have never found a source that I could justify the cost

    good luck with the project
    cheers Patrick
    • CommentAuthorcc64
    • CommentTimeDec 9th 2020
     
    Thanks Patrick, I do have a copy of PAS2035; after trawling thru a raft of would be vouchers a found one offering 50% off. It's a tad more abstract than I would like, essentially referencing various other regulatory docs for details. Great for pulling all these together in one place.
    I have not yet received quotes for the insulation. It's not cheap. Neither is willfully heating the air outside our homes.
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