Green Building Forum - Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? Tue, 19 Dec 2023 07:06:39 +0000 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303383#Comment_303383 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303383#Comment_303383 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 18:52:57 +0100 greenfinger
We had the roughcast render hacked off the stone wall of our house, and the pointing replaced with lime mortar. There are no foundations. At the time, I pulled back the gravel at the footings of the wall, creating a bit of a trench. There's hard compacted soil beneath the bottom stones. But in some places, there's quite a deep void until you get to the soil (a horizontal void). In the "worse" places, I can get my hand and wrist in there to around halfway along my forearm.

Should I look to fill these horizontal voids before all the gravel gets pushed back into place? Or is it enough to just let the gravel fill them? If I do fill them, what would be best to use? I was thinking NHL lime (3.5?) but also using stones under there to help bind the mortar and to prevent having to use too much of it. But that's a total guess and I'm all ears on what I should use, if indeed anything.

Aside from doing what's right for the building, it does seem that mice are quite keen to scurry their way into the wall (and house) through these deep voids. I've got them blocked with plastic at the moment to stop that. I'd want to make sure whatever I do stops mice getting in.

Pics below, showing the deepest and shallowest sections. And just to be clear, when the gravel is put back to how it was, these voids would be below ground level.

Many thanks]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303384#Comment_303384 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303384#Comment_303384 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 18:53:19 +0100 greenfinger Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303385#Comment_303385 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303385#Comment_303385 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 18:53:34 +0100 greenfinger Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303386#Comment_303386 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303386#Comment_303386 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 18:54:14 +0100 greenfinger Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303387#Comment_303387 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303387#Comment_303387 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 18:54:35 +0100 greenfinger Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303388#Comment_303388 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303388#Comment_303388 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 18:54:50 +0100 greenfinger Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303389#Comment_303389 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303389#Comment_303389 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 20:56:48 +0100 djh Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303393#Comment_303393 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303393#Comment_303393 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 22:41:49 +0100 tony Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303395#Comment_303395 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303395#Comment_303395 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 23:06:43 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303396#Comment_303396 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303396#Comment_303396 Mon, 18 Sep 2023 23:52:34 +0100 greenfinger
By limecrete, are we talking NHL5? Mixed with both sand and gravel? What ratios if so please?

Thanks again]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303398#Comment_303398 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303398#Comment_303398 Tue, 19 Sep 2023 08:35:17 +0100 tony Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303399#Comment_303399 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303399#Comment_303399 Tue, 19 Sep 2023 08:52:29 +0100 greenfinger
I've got some fancy sand from Ty Mawr. Should I save that for the pointing I need to do, and just buy bog standard cheaper sharp sand from the builders merch for this job?

And NHL5?

Cheers]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303401#Comment_303401 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303401#Comment_303401 Tue, 19 Sep 2023 09:19:04 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Just to add to my previous comment - the stones are pushed in to help prevent the limecrete slumping out before it sets.]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303402#Comment_303402 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303402#Comment_303402 Tue, 19 Sep 2023 09:35:57 +0100 greenfinger
OK, so I will part fill the voids with the limecrete. Then push larger stones in which will displace some of the lime and bring it forward, then fill any more spaces at the front with further limcrete.

Would you do it so that the front of the stones are:

- Not visible. "Buried" by the limecrete so all you can see is limecrete at the front?
- Visible when finished, and then point around them? So that they pretty much continue the wall down?
- Protruding? Use longer larger stones that are partly in the void and partly sticking our beyond the front face of the wall?

Many thanks]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303404#Comment_303404 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303404#Comment_303404 Tue, 19 Sep 2023 11:20:43 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303558#Comment_303558 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303558#Comment_303558 Wed, 27 Sep 2023 16:04:06 +0100 greenfinger
Been away for a few days, but hoping to do this tomorrow/Friday.

Just got a couple more questions if you don't mind. Can I just pack the mortar in against the compacted soil? Or do I need to do something to the soil prior to using the mortar?

And is it best to work when the compacted soil is wet or dry?

Many thanks]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303560#Comment_303560 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303560#Comment_303560 Wed, 27 Sep 2023 17:54:49 +0100 tony
I would not disturb anything below the bottom most stone]]> Voids under stone wall (no foundations) - can I fill them and with what if so? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303561#Comment_303561 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=17958&Focus=303561#Comment_303561 Wed, 27 Sep 2023 19:21:59 +0100 Peter_in_Hungary Posted By: tonyAny soil in between the stonework should be brushed out before repointing or packing.
Lots of stone built walls over here are stone/rubble with earth infill. If yours is this sort of wall caution is needed in removing the internal contents of the wall. Brush out only what is loose and disturb the minimum necessary to effect the repair.

Posted By: tonyI would not disturb anything below the bottom most stone

+1]]>