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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

PLEASE NOTE: A download link for Volume 1 will be sent to you by email and Volume 2 will be sent to you by post as a book.

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    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2008 edited
     
    I've read the discussions on Zurich and NHBC and I am a bit concerned about the experiences of the contributors!
    We are about to start a new build. Could anyone recommend the best course of action, or any other options available?
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartian
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2008
     
    • CommentAuthorTimber
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2008
     
    premier have minimal info in their technical manual! Although i believe that is soon to change! And LABC have questionable policies on novel designs... although that my work IN your favour, depending on what you are building.

    What are your worries about NHBC and Zurich?

    Make sure all products you use are all 3rd party approved where necessary!

    My worry is that warenty providers are NOT hard enough on people/builders!
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 2nd 2008
     
    Posted By: Sally MI've read the discussions on Zurich and NHBC
    Where? I need to see this. Martian, are these an alternative to the de facto (mortgage requirement) necessity to have NHBC Certification?
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartian
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    Hi Tom,
    As far as I know these guarantees are both full alternatives to the NHBC or Zurich schemes. My view of the market is that the quality of the guarantee is really only as good as the quality supervising surveyor who checks the work together with the insurance company which underwrites the policy.
    In my experience the insurance companies are all bean-counters who will be much the same and therefore the critical factor is the surveyor. Speak to trustworthy builders and architects who have used the various guarantee providers in the area and see who they recommend.
    In my area I have heard horror stories of some and good reports of others.
    Here is a lttle more on LABC warrantiies:
    http://www.sitelines.co.uk/pdfs/26459.pdf
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    All of these are insurances and if you build properly you wont need or benefit from them. It is also notoriously difficult to get a claim through and they dont cover very much either. A normal home insurance policy covers more!
    • CommentAuthorPete1951
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    Tony, try selling a new build without NHBC or Zurich etc in the first ten years to somebody needing a mortgage and you'll find it impossible.
    • CommentAuthorCWatters
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    From what I can tell most of the problems people have with warranties is the limited cover they provide. Typically they seem to cover defects that are unavoidable such as unexpected subsidence but they tend to resist some claims for defects that are really build quality issues. For example I recall a case where someone had problems with the drains blocking every few months because too many bends were used. The drains appeard to meet the letter of the regs but not good practice. The insurer claimed there was no evidence the drains didn't work or had become faulty since construction.

    So take out a policy to aid reselling but make sure you have a good builder!
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    try selling a new build without NHBC or Zurich etc in the first ten years to somebody needing a mortgage and you'll find it impossible.

    This seems to me be be an illegal closed shop/restrictive practice arrangement.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    Posted By: tonyif you build properly you wont need or benefit from them
    That's been my approach - never had PI and only once feared a claim, due to arithmetical error in an Interim Certificate, which left the client out of pocket when the contractor went bust.

    Would these insurance policies pay out, and then come after the architect if it was his negligence? Is it really an alternative to PI, or as Pete1951 and CWatters say, just a required wangle, alternative to the traditional NHBC one?
  1.  
    Posted By: fostertomhat's been my approach - never had PI and only once feared a claim,


    Tom,

    how do you get away with no insurance as a registered architect? Or are you not registered?

    From: http://www.architecture.com/Files/RIBAProfessionalServices/ProfessionalConduct/Constitution/CodeOfConduct/GN5Insurance.pdf

    5.1 RIBA Requirements
    Members practising architecture are exposed to the risk of being sued for negligence or breaches of contract. Some form of insurance should therefore be held which will generally cover liabilities arising from such claims. Holding appropriate insurance cover is a requirement of an RIBA Registered Practice.
    5.2 ARB Requirements
    In the UK, the Architects Registration Board requires all practising registered persons to be covered by a professional indemnity insurance (PII) policy. Advice should be sought from the ARB regarding the level of cover it requires for a member’s income and portfolio.


    Paul in Montreal.
    • CommentAuthorFred56
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    I have built under certificate from a Chartered Structural Engineer and I sold my house. However, not all lenders will accept the certification route because it relies upon the PI insurance of the engineer. That said, I have also sold a barn conversion with nothing at all, the issue was never even mentioned. If you are building to sell, you’d be mad to build without certification or warranty. I like certification because I trust proper engineers, though not architects.
    Once a property has been occupied the requirement for a warranty changes - check the lender's handbooks on the CML website. A warranty vendor won't metion this though. If you need a mortgage to build, you need to speak to your lender quick, don't put a spade in the ground until you have.
    Above, my opinions only. Five succesful self-builds, zero warranties.
    • CommentAuthorabomb1969
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    Fred65 is right. There is only a requirement for a new build house built by a developer to have a warranty. If you are self building you don't need a warranty. A mortgage company does not require the warrranty on resale of a house to the second owner. However the purchasers solicitor may recommend against purchase without the warranty, sods law.

    I had to get a warranty as my architectural technician's qualifications were not good enough for the mortgage co. Went with Premier, it was half the price of NHBC.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008 edited
     
    Posted By: Paul in Montrealare you not registered?
    Correct - I'm a B.SC.(Architecture), 'in Architecture', not 'an Architect'. A good friend of mine led the RIBA effort to uprate the status of Architects, back in the 80s. In the end, all that was achieved was a few bureaucratic measures, like making PI and CPD compulsory. Neither did anything to improve the abysmal standard of as-built 'architecture'. As ever, it's still a 10% lake of excellent architectural firms in a 90% ocean of mediocrity and a 40% sea of downright awfulness. CPD was the biggest failure of all - whereas Doctors and to an extent Solicitors depend absolutely on CPD to keep up to date, to Architects it's just repackaged trade presentations with wine, sandwiches and so many brownie-points towards the obligatory quota. The one and only effect on me of my friend's campaign was that I stopped getting my weekly free Building Design, then an excellent trade rag (unlike its present arty-farty online form). I spoke to the Publisher, said I'd been a career-long reader and contributor. He said sorry, we've agreed to only give it to 'proper' Architects - you'll have to pay if you want it. No other problems - PI is available to me at same price as to Architects, if I wanted it.
    • CommentAuthorSally M
    • CommentTimeSep 3rd 2008
     
    This has been very enlightening. Thank you very much indeed.
    Keep the advice coming, please.
    I have got many more questions on virtually all the other headings...........huge learning!
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