Have the same here and asked on another forum. This seemed like the probable answer to me

"It appears that this is quite a common phenomenon and ------ second explanation is right. It usually occurs with two way switched lighting where adjacent cables often run a considerable distance and there is a tiny pick up due to electromagnetic induction. It is safe and not a problem."

Edit. Just re read and realised this is when yours were turned on. Ours glowed when turned off.

I've not had a problem with LEDs flickering unless on a dimmer. Turning them down even slightly and they start flickering like mad. Worse when viewed in peripheral vision which responds faster.

"It appears that this is quite a common phenomenon and ------ second explanation is right. It usually occurs with two way switched lighting where adjacent cables often run a considerable distance and there is a tiny pick up due to electromagnetic induction. It is safe and not a problem."

I think that issue is to do with LEDs flickering when they are meant to be off. I have 7 LEDs in a bathroom, or rather I would have 7 LEDs but I've had to put one halogen. With just LEDs there is enough stray coupling for them to light up when they are meant to be off. Incidentally fitting one halogen doesn't stop current flowing when they are off it just hides the problem so this fix still wastes a little power even if you ignore the extra consumption due to the halogen.

Interesting - Daryl, the flickering fittings are on separate circuits, so it can't be the MCB's. Not sure what to look for in terms of the form factor?? The earthing on the system is very good - according to the electrician.

Steamy - we don't have PV as it's way too expensive in France. To connect to the system and get the tax refund you have to use a registered company that have all the necessary certificates. They keep the prices high as you are going to get a tax refund, so the payback is daft - especially for OAP's! We are on a low limit / temp supply but I can't see that giving me issues unless it's the lower voltage at busy times issue? We have noticed slower cooking early evening!!

Neither set of LED's are two way switched nor on dimmers.

Thanks for the comments guys - regards, Jonathan

Hi,
Looks like LED specs need updating. This could easily be cured by better design. The wiring regs/custom in the UK is also a bit dubious as the usual way to switch lights on and off is to have one side connected to neutral permanently. The live is then switched to the other side. When off this side is left open circuit. No problem with incandescants as low current pickup/fluctuations cannot be seen. If this side had a changeover switch and switched to live for on and neutral for off this would probally cure most cases of flicker.

Richard

Posted By: CWatters
I think that issue is to do with LEDs flickering when they are meant to be off. I have 7 LEDs in a bathroom, or rather I would have 7 LEDs but I've had to put one halogen. With just LEDs there is enough stray coupling for them to light up when they are meant to be off. Incidentally fitting one halogen doesn't stop current flowing when they are off it just hides the problem so this fix still wastes a little power even if you ignore the extra consumption due to the halogen.

Is Richard's explanation above connected to your bathroom issue. In which case wouldn't a double-pole light switch help?

Also, our old mate Jeremy, over at the other place, has done some research into LEDs and found that many of the controllers are not to good.
Have a hunt around there and see if it helps.

I would guess at the controllers, effectively turning them on/off very fast...as the voltage drops?
Have you measured the voltage at the 'flicker' time?

Cheers

Posted By: db8000Is Richard's explanation above connected to your bathroom issue. In which case wouldn't a double-pole light switch help?

Now that's an interesting idea. Thanks.

Posted By: Ed DaviesAwkward to get the neutral to and from the switch as well, perhaps.

One of the reasons my electrician likes to run the lighting circuits as radials to the switches and then multiple switched circuits up to the fittings. Makes changes easier as well as understanding it for my tired brain.

came across some of these new LED filament bulbs in the local diy store recently, seem to be a vast improvement on everything else, have a search on youtube ( Edison LED bulb ), there are some vids and explanations, don't flicker, orangey or white light if you want it, works with dimmer and should be reliable if the transformer is of good quality, makes me very happy to see these solutions coming to market

One of the reasons my electrician likes to run the lighting circuits as radials to the switches and then multiple switched circuits up to the fittings

How does he join the wires at the switch? (As they don't have handy terminals for this, unlike ceiling roses or junction boxes)

<blockquote><cite>Posted By: wookey</cite>How does he join the wires at the switch? (As they don't have handy terminals for this, unlike ceiling roses or junction boxes)</blockquote>

djh can probably tell you himself, but I guess we are talking about multi-gang switches *and* several lamps off each switch. The way I handle this is with Wago connectors stuffed into a deep back box, or behind a blank plate next to the switches.

For fan-out to individual downlights, I rather unwillingly resort to Wago boxes tucked into the ceiling where they can be reached (for maintenance and wiring regs compliance) through the downlighter holes.

I wish manufacturers would put double terminals on all light fittings, to make them easier to daisy-chain. Ikea does this on some of their lights. Anyone know of other makers who do it? It really should be possible to instal multiple luminaires in parallel without using junction boxes or shoving two wires into a terminal made for one.

Also (respect to Ikea again, though their quality is not as good as Wago) why not spring-loaded 'cage clamp' terminals on light fittings instead of unreliable, fiddly and slow-to-instal screw terminals?

Posted By: fostertomIt's always seemed to me that electricianing regs, fittings and techniques are a conspiracy to generate as many work-hours as possible - an apparently hi-tech industry that conspicuously drags its feet, compared even with lo-tech (you'd think, static) ones like plastering - and it gets worse with each regs update.

I'll second that. Why do they not use the WAGO type connectors directly on the fittings!

Friend building in France says they use single wires pulled through flexible conduit and everything is radial.

The most annoying fittings I have are surface mounting multi-light spot clusters. They have a piece of chocolate strip inside with one terminal screwed to the mounting both as an earth connection and the mechanical fixing. It's very difficult to connect the wires and then manipulate the fitting, the screws and screwdriver without ever letting go of the fitting since the mechanical fixing isn't strong enough to support it's weight!

Posted By: rhamduYou need a fourth hand when a screw falls out.

Yes, or a blasted lot of patience to put it all together again. Don't ask me how I know this!