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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

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    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2023 edited
     
    Thought it would be worth going into the Octopus trial.

    Not a lot to the certification side (DNO, Build Regs, Elec certs and so on). I doubt we'll recover the cost (£250) as next stage is the battery. But signed up anyway as being non-MCS but paid export might make a second 'winter array' a worthwhile thing to do (too unique/niche to interest most installers).
    • CommentAuthorphiledge
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2023
     
    Did you actually get building control approval for the PV load? If you did what info did you submit?

    I've got the Octopus invite to join the trial but with their £250 fee, BC fee and electricians fee, I'm not sure it's going to be worth it
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2023
     
    Hi Phil

    a) Building control approval for the electrical works (more or less the same thing as the safety cert) so BC don't approve the electrical load (but if you mean structural see below)
    b) Elec Cert
    c) Then DNO & approval email plus number for export
    d) Then max export (kW) figures

    Outbuilding set away from boundary so Part A / B not applicable (not that anyone seems to bother under MCS: I even had an installer tell me that MCS makes him a competent person to self certify structural works). However, structural was checked by a Chartered structural engineer (ie me)

    Other than that: all there was to it. We couldn't do MCS because it's a prototype from a Structural point of view and standard installers wouldn't want to touch it (we can safely remove individual panels in less than 10 minutes without needing scaffold and there's a few other innovations). They might come back with something else but we're seriously well documented so don't forsee an issue.
    • CommentAuthorphiledge
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2023 edited
     
    Thanks for clarifying. It was the additional structural load that I think Octopus want to see the BC approval for. A part P spark will do the elec cert but if Ive got to get BC involved I might ask them to do it all.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2023
     
    Posted By: jonWe couldn't do MCS because it's a prototype from a Structural point of view and standard installers wouldn't want to touch it (we can safely remove individual panels in less than 10 minutes without needing scaffold and there's a few other innovations). They might come back with something else but we're seriously well documented so don't forsee an issue.
    I'd be interested in the details if you're willing to share. Just for interest at this stage.

    BTW, I am supplied by Coop Energy/Octopus and I have a PV system and haven't received an invite. Is that normal. The PV system is registered with Good Energy so that may account for it.
    • CommentAuthorphiledge
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2023
     
    I think you have to register your interest in getting non MCS export payments from Octopus.
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2023
     
    Posted By: philedgeThanks for clarifying. It was the additional structural load that I think Octopus want to see the BC approval for.


    Could well be. The Part A/B compliance side is a bit unclear. It'll probably get highlighted by one particular publication in the coming months, so imagine that things will get clearer after that.
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2023
     
    Posted By: djhI'd be interested in the details if you're willing to share. Just for interest at this stage.


    Will have to do a 'thread' about it. Nothing particularly confidential: more a case of doing it to show that it can be done (so quite small scale). The aim was to showcase how to achieve:

    1) Highest possible electrical safety
    2) Lowest possible fire risk
    3) Increased durability of the existing roof under
    4) The look of an in-roof system
    5) As good performance as standard on-roof solar
    6) Slid-in/slide out panels for access
    7) All maintainable without scaffold

    no 4 Might particularly interest Tom if he's still here

    It worked well but I probably over-designed some aspects to be certain that there would be no issue. There's also one or two 'tweaks' that I would, in retrospect, do differently. I'm planning to do a write-up when we're complete.
      F2nxMsFXoAg69Mg.jpg
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2023
     
    Thanks. I look forward to seeing the write-up when you're ready. The brackets and the scaffold free maintenance seem like the most interesting aspects to me.
    • CommentAuthorborpin
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2023
     
    I'd think about a ground mounted system.
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2023
     
    Posted By: djhI look forward to seeing the write-up when you're ready. The brackets and the scaffold free maintenance seem like the most interesting aspects to me.


    Will do. Scaff free might be trickier if two storey (but still feasible)


    Posted By: borpinI'd think about a ground mounted system.


    limit to 9sqm under PD, together with the other rules, tend to work against it. It's a curious quirk of PD rules that you can build 30sqm, tile it with solar and then claim it's a different class of build under PD (though I'm not sure if anyone's actually tried that)
  1.  
    Posted By: jonI'm not sure if anyone's actually tried that


    I don't see why that wouldn't work, as long as all the other criteria to comply with Class E (outbuildings) applied to the structure.
    A Log, bike or bin store springs to mind, it might avoid the need for any walls.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeSep 7th 2023
     
    Posted By: Dominic CooneyA Log, bike or bin store springs to mind, it might avoid the need for any walls.
    A 30 m² bin store.My mind is boggled!
  2.  
    I do a lot of recycling!

    Or it could be a yoga suite, home gym, dog kennel, rain-proof clothes drying area, car port, pizza oven / outdoor food area, electric scooter or mobility scooter charging area, garden produce storage area, roofed-over hot tub (AKA chlamydia pool)

    Basically anything that is ancillary to the use of the dwellinghouse.
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 8th 2023
     
    Posted By: Dominic CooneyBasically anything that is ancillary to the use of the dwellinghouse


    Haha: yes. And the cost of the structure & substructure can be reduced a lot if your structure is triangulated. If you can make an E-W arrangement work, the inverter (or inverters) can then use both sides of the array with combined feeds (the max power point tracking is almost identical if your array is identical both sides and facing exactly east and west).

    That's part of the reason for the thin band of panels in the above that you can see nearest to the camera. That's a 4 panel arrangement: 2 east in series (in the shot) with 2 west, also with wiring in series (out of shot), and then joined in parallel to a single micro-inverter. I wanted to see how it performed in practice.
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2023
     
    Approved for export as of today
  3.  
    Done a few solar pergolas when sticking them on roofs or ground was an issue
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeNov 15th 2023
     
    djh:

    I've added my maintenance file for this one as an attachment. Not a full write up (eg no lessons learned) but gives an idea. It's quite expensive to do it this way so suspect it'd only have a fairly niche market. But it helps to protect an existing felt roof and makes it more maintainable (idea being to extend the usable life of the felt so that it matches, or exceeds, that of the solar panels themselves)

    Also disclaimer: very important for anyone who's not in construction reading this. I've not covered everything someone would need to know so it's just a general idea of how to do about it sort of thing. The details are very important (eg using neoprene washers in places, fix details, how the batten fixes were done, lightning protection, edge trimming etc). You must have a qualified electrician to do a part of this type of install.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeNov 15th 2023
     
    Many thanks, Jon. That's a very impressive build and a very impressive booklet. :bigsmile:
    • CommentAuthorjon
    • CommentTimeNov 16th 2023
     
    Thanks Dave

    The neighbourhood seems to like it. The general view seems to be that it looks better with the solar panels than it did without them. I think that's because the panels cover the entire roof.

    A few of the details were done so that I could be sure that I complied with the existing letter (back in last decade) from the council confirming compliance of certain allowable dimensions. It's why there's only a small overhang and why the gap at the eaves is so small. Could have been less expensive if it wasn't a backwardly complying retrofit. I would definitely make the overhang more (say 300 to 400mm) if I were doing this without having to worry about compliance: the micro inverters (or whatever) would then become accessible with no effort at all.
      20210122_095938a.jpg
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