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    • CommentAuthorkebabman
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012 edited
     
    Please could someone give me some links to suppliers of grey EPS as I am struggling to find the stuff online.

    I want to attach EPS to lime pointed rubble stone walls, some externally but mainly internally, what's the best way to do this please?
    And then to lime render it afterwards, do I need to attach some form of mesh to the EPS to give a key for the lime?

    Many thanks
    • CommentAuthorSaint
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012 edited
     
    • CommentAuthorkebabman
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012 edited
     
    Many thanks Saint, I see on this thread http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/comments.php?DiscussionID=5981&page=1
    poster JMS452 says "This gives the vapour resistance of 'FRA grade' EPS as 6.9MNs/gm. That's about 20 fold less than the figure used by the www.natural-building.co.uk/PDF/Breathability-Matters-response-to-Kingspan.pdf article. " is this the platinum grade?

    If anyone has bought some EPS platinum recently and got a good price I would be very grateful for a post here or a whisper as where to go please as I can find prices for the ordinary stuff but I am keen to work out if its worth paying extra for the bit better u value and also the better breathability if that is the case.

    Cheers
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    I have bought about 100m3 of EPS in the last 3 months. my advice is to come up with the exact amount you need and farm it out to your local builders merchants, my experience of trying to buy direct from manufacturer even on my large amount (1 artic load) was don’t bother, i tried Springvale, k Meltzer and jabalite all were reluctant, in the end my local merchant was the cheapest maybe due to the prospect of getting the rest of my trade, plus they have all the logistical problems.
    • CommentAuthorkebabman
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    Many thanks for the reply an02ew, did you go for the platinum version or the normal EPS?
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    If you only want a small amount try BnQ:
    http://www.diy.com/nav/build/insulation/constructional-insulation/insulation_boards/Jablite-Premium-Universal-Insulation-Board-Grey-10647758

    I doubt that the grey stuff pays for itself in terms of thermal performance (i.e. its >20% more expensive) but one you factor in floor-area/eaves/ceiling-height and fixings its a different matter.

    Afraid I have no memory of what FRA grade is (think I was just quoting a report)
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    Posted By: kebabmanMany thanks for the reply an02ew, did you go for the platinum version or the normal EPS?


    A mix of both about 50/50 throughout the whole job and verious thickness too
    • CommentAuthorkebabman
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    Many thanks for the the replies guys, sorry to be nosey but was there any particular reason for the 50/50 mix an02ew?
    • CommentAuthorCav8andrew
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    I am yet to make enquiries but 2 names I have are eccleston + hart and Sand B eps. Might be worth trying for an alternative price, both appear to have a platinum product. However it does sound as if an02ew has explored the various possibilities.
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 17th 2012
     
    Posted By: kebabmansorry to be nosey but was there any particular reason for the 50/50 mix an02ew?


    Because different element of my build required different thickness to achieve required u value.

    Under floor slab 2x150mm eps70 (offset layers)
    New exstenion walls 1x 200mm eps70 (with warmcel500 pumped timber frame)
    Old cottage walls 1x 225 eps platinum
    Old cottage roof 1 x 125 eps platinum (with warmcel500 pumped between rafters)
    • CommentAuthorMikeRumney
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2012
     
    Don't know if this is of help but ...
    Got mine from Ireland, via suggestion from Viking House
    Airpacks Ltd:
    54 x 1.2 by 0.6 EPS Platinum 150mm: £915 inc del to Glos etc.
    • CommentAuthorMikeRumney
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2012
     
    ... that was EPS Platinum 70 btw ...
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2012
     
    Posted By: MikeRumneyGot mine from Ireland, via suggestion from Viking House
    Airpacks Ltd:
    54 x 1.2 by 0.6 EPS Platinum 150mm: £915 inc del to Glos etc.


    yes he was cheap on price for my lot . but the delivery from Ireland just killed it.. shame
  1.  
    thats £17 a sheet for 150mm? Prices up then
    Got some 200mm in 2011 for £12 ish inc.
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2012
     
    Posted By: jamesingramthats £17 a sheet for 150mm? Prices up then
    Got some 200mm in 2011 for £12 ish inc.

    8x4 sheets?
    • CommentAuthorjamesingram
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2012 edited
     
    600/1200 , just divide mikes £915 by 54 for the £17 a sheet cost ( he was talking 600/1200 also)
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 19th 2012
     
    Just dug out my prices from local merchant all plus VAT


    thickness grade conductivity size price per sheet

    225mm platinum 0.030 0.6x1.2 £11.73
    125mm platinum 0.030 1.2x2.4 £20.03
    200mm standard 0.040 1.2x2.4 £18.72
    150mm standard 0.040 1.2x2.4 £14.16
    • CommentAuthornikhoward
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2012
     
    Posted By: an02ewI have bought about 100m3 of EPS in the last 3 months. my advice is to come up with the exact amount you need and farm it out to your local builders merchants, my experience of trying to buy direct from manufacturer even on my large amount (1 artic load) was don’t bother, i tried Springvale, k Meltzer and jabalite all were reluctant, in the end my local merchant was the cheapest maybe due to the prospect of getting the rest of my trade, plus they have all the logistical problems.


    Good advice, thanks, I would have been asking the same questions as OP my self in the future.
    • CommentAuthorgrumpy
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2012
     
    Andrew - an02ew - a few questions.

    1. Are you saying you used EPS70 under slab, i.e. under the reinforced slab shown in your picture in thread

    http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/comments.php?DiscussionID=7573&page=2

    If so, was this EPS density discussed with an engineer? Were they concerned about long term creep of the EPS? And did the BCO seem happy with it?

    2. Is there a thread with further discussion and/or pictures of built-up EPS foundation tubs for flat reinforced slabs?

    3. When you built your EPS formwork, did you glue the perimeter EPS on top of extended slab EPS (horizontal joint), or fix the perimeter EPS to the side of the slab EPS (vertical joint)?

    4. How did you prop and secure the perimeter from the outside?

    5. How accurate was the final result - in terms of levels and dimensions of slab?

    Best - Brian
    • CommentAuthorGreenPaddy
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2012
     
    kebabman, try Eccleston & Hart (also suggested above). They don't deliver, but their prices are superb. Hire yourself a van, or if getting enough, pay for an artic. to deliver. If you give the artic driver enough notice, he should be able to deliver at a one-way cost (ie. return leg of another delivery). They're based beside the M6 in Birmingham.
    Speak to Renata, and ask for a better price than they show on their website, again assuming you are buying a reasonable amount. Also (double bertie bonus) their cost is per sheet, which comes out of a 2.5m x 1.25m block, so you pay the same for that size as you would if they cut it to 2.4mx1.2m. (about 8% more for free).

    No links to the above company - just a satisfied customer.
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2012 edited
     
    Posted By: GreenPaddyIf you give the artic driver enough notice, he should be able to deliver at a one-way cost (ie. return leg of another delivery)
    Seek quotes for return trips thro http://www.shiply.com
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2012
     
    Posted By: grumpy1. Are you saying you used EPS70 under slab, i.e. under the reinforced slab shown in your picture in thread


    yes 2 layers laminated with offset joints


    Posted By: grumpyIf so, was this EPS density discussed with an engineer? Were they concerned about long term creep of the EPS? And did the BCO seem happy with it?


    yes yes and yes, althought im not being fair. the raft is supported on 9 pionts, conc pads 1m2 down to good ground then built up from there in 7n thermolite blocks to underside of re-inforced slab(thats my only cold bridge in the floor)the EPS is just a insulted shutter.


    Posted By: grumpyIs there a thread with further discussion and/or pictures of built-up EPS foundation tubs for flat reinforced slabs?


    Dont know



    Posted By: grumpyWhen you built your EPS formwork, did you glue the perimeter EPS on top of extended slab EPS (horizontal joint), or fix the perimeter EPS to the side of the slab EPS (vertical joint)?


    Both. The whole EPS shutter is glued and by laminating 2x150mm i have created a stronger corner/upstand. first upstand is on top(horizontal joint) then another base board(vert joint) and finally another upstand.





    Posted By: grumpyHow did you prop and secure the perimeter from the outside?



    Land drain runs low level around perimeter of EPS backfilled with clean stone which is packed against ground level(our slabs sat just lower than the ground untill the conc pour then i reduced a bit further where needed)



    Posted By: grumpyHow accurate was the final result - in terms of levels and dimensions of slab?



    Overall slab sizes is 11.4M x 7.3M we finished with a wood float to except stone floor direct. the accuracy is very acceptable +-15mm on upstand +- 5mm on level
    • CommentAuthorgrumpy
    • CommentTimeSep 21st 2012 edited
     
    Thanks. I thought there must be more to the foundation. Perhaps it is the piled foundation you posted here, or a cousin?

    http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/comments.php?DiscussionID=9308

    I have a follow-up. I'm going to start a new thread "EPS grades" in case anyone else has comments.

    Cheers.
    • CommentAuthorMikeRumney
    • CommentTimeSep 24th 2012
     
    Posted By: an02ew
    Posted By: MikeRumneyGot mine from Ireland, via suggestion from Viking House
    Airpacks Ltd:
    54 x 1.2 by 0.6 EPS Platinum 150mm: £915 inc del to Glos etc.


    yes he was cheap on price for my lot . but the delivery from Ireland just killed it.. shame


    I could only get a comparison with Springvale at the time ... and Airpacks had a load already aged, so they could send it immediately, which was a factor.
    There comes a point, if you're doing a single-handed project, when the compromises start creeping in ...
    Road miles, fewer quotes etc etc.
    • CommentAuthorkebabman
    • CommentTimeSep 25th 2012 edited
     
    <blockquote><cite>Posted By: kebabman</cite>
    I want to attach EPS to lime pointed rubble stone walls, some externally but mainly internally, what's the best way to do this please?
    And then to lime render it afterwards, do I need to attach some form of mesh to the EPS to give a key for the lime?

    </blockquote>
    Many thanks for the replies, can anyone help please with my questions above regarding fixing and whether I need any mesh?
    Cheers
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeSep 25th 2012
     
    kebabman, there's loads of stuff on here about that kind of thing, and I think your question suggests you haven't got the hang of it - search for EWI.
    • CommentAuthoran02ew
    • CommentTimeSep 25th 2012
     
    Posted By: kebabmanI want to attach EPS to lime pointed rubble stone walls, some externally but mainly internally, what's the best way to do this please?


    Try Parex. They will advise on fixing to all substrates, but only give advice on their products obviously.
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