Tue, 19 Dec 2023 05:14:06 +0000 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/ Lussumo Vanilla 1.0.3 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189894#Comment_189894 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189894#Comment_189894 Sat, 23 Nov 2013 12:35:24 +0000 barge17
I have a bit of a dilemma, the obvious thing to do would be to ask United Utilities the question, but as you will see, that could become very expensive.

30 years ago we established a smallholding about 600metres down a narrow lane and installed a water meter in the land where our supply joins the village main water supply pipe. Our pipe is 32mm MDPE and has given excellent service, never leaking over the period, and pressure at our end has always been great.

However, about 20 years ago we built and sold another house, keeping the one supply for both properties with the agreement that we pay the bill and the other owner reimburses us with a proportion of it.

If we now decide to have a meter for each property, the only straightforward way to do that would be to dig the whole length of the lane again for a new pipe with all the reinstatement cost and upset. What I would like to do is split the pipe at the junction between the two house supplies, and install 2 meters, but I doubt whether the water authority would agree to coming down the lane to read them and somebody would need to take the risk of the pipe leaking down the length of the lane, which sounds fair enough to me.

As far as I know, I don't think remote reading meters are used yet. Anyone have an idea which way to go?

thanks, Barge17]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189897#Comment_189897 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189897#Comment_189897 Sat, 23 Nov 2013 13:06:29 +0000 Jonti
Jonti]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189948#Comment_189948 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189948#Comment_189948 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 08:19:24 +0000 barge17 "see if the water company would install two new meters at the properties"

that is what I am now planning to do, but my worry is that once I have admitted to the fact that there are now two individual properties here, they will force us into going the whole distance with a second pipe.

That is also why I ask the question on this forum anonymously rather than UU direct, hoping that someone has done something similar. cheers, barge17]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189951#Comment_189951 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189951#Comment_189951 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 08:38:44 +0000 Jonti
my take would be that the current arrangement has been accepted by the water companies so if they were to insist on a change then they would carry the costs. What you might find is that the 32mm pipe is not up to current standards and the a 63mm pipe might be needed with hydrant hook up point at the end as I would think 600m would be too far for the fire brigade.

Jonti]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189954#Comment_189954 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189954#Comment_189954 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 08:47:28 +0000 Triassic
Alternatively if that fails, a farmer neighbour and the camp site next door are on a single pipe supply and they decided to go for metering, they each have a private meter at the branch off the private pipe and a New U U meter was installed at the start of the private supply where it joins the public supply. In that way they can each check their 2 bills add up to the amount passing through the main meter. Saved a lot of digging and cost.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189958#Comment_189958 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189958#Comment_189958 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 09:24:20 +0000 Cav8andrew http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189967#Comment_189967 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189967#Comment_189967 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 10:16:00 +0000 CWatters What I would like to do is split the pipe at the junction between the two house supplies, and install 2 meters, but I doubt whether the water authority would agree to coming down the lane to read them.

I'm sure there are places where they have to go down a long driveway to get to the meter.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189994#Comment_189994 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189994#Comment_189994 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 17:49:43 +0000 barge17 .
Thanks a lot for your replies, just what I needed, plenty of options to try before direct contact and possibly making things worse. What I didn't say in the beginning is that due to a misunderstanding a tap got left open a couple of months ago and the first we knew about it last week was a huge bill which now needs paying.

A remote reading meter would be a wise investment to help stop this happening again.

" a farmer neighbour and the camp site next door are on a single pipe supply and they decided to go for metering"
Yes, but it sounds like they didn't have a meter before, so it would be in UU's interest to have two new meters + 2 sets of standing charge, etc.


"check out when remote readers will come in "

I shall have a look round UU's website. good idea
.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189999#Comment_189999 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=189999#Comment_189999 Sun, 24 Nov 2013 19:04:36 +0000 barge17 "Since 1990, every newly built property has had a water meter installed.
From the 1st April 2010, it is UUW policy that all new standard connections will have meters that are capable
of being remotely read. This means access to the property is not needed to obtain a meter reading, meaning
that we can install meters in locations that are more accessible to customers and avoid issues usually
associated with traditional meter installations in the footpath or boundary. The available options are listed
below.
Where the required meter size is 25mm or above, the meter location may be internal, located at a suitable point
where the pipework enters the building or external and located in a purpose built underground meter chamber.

United Utilities’ preferred metering policy is one unit, one meter, one
connection. However, we recognise that there are certain types of
premises where this policy is difficult or impractical to achieve. In these
situations an alternative solution to metering has to be reached. The
following meter location options are available for this property type.


1. Installation of AMR meters in each
individual unit

Where AMR meters are installed internally in each
individual unit, they will be installed in the concentric
meter adaptor fitted by the developer directly above
the internal stop tap.

This is a Southern water page:

http://www.southernwater.co.uk/at-home/your-water/water-meters/your-meter-reading/your-amr-meter.asp]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190032#Comment_190032 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190032#Comment_190032 Mon, 25 Nov 2013 08:40:52 +0000 Jonti Posted By: barge17From their site:
1. Installation of AMR meters in each
individual unit

Where AMR meters are installed internally in each
individual unit, they will be installed in the concentric
meter adaptor fitted by the developer directly above
the internal stop tap.

This is a Southern water page:

http://www.southernwater.co.uk/at-home/your-water/water-meters/your-meter-reading/your-amr-meter.asp



Looks like that is your solution and you can even fit it yourself]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190037#Comment_190037 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190037#Comment_190037 Mon, 25 Nov 2013 08:58:17 +0000 renewablejohn http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190041#Comment_190041 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190041#Comment_190041 Mon, 25 Nov 2013 09:23:02 +0000 Ed Davies http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190047#Comment_190047 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190047#Comment_190047 Mon, 25 Nov 2013 10:27:29 +0000 renewablejohn http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190078#Comment_190078 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190078#Comment_190078 Mon, 25 Nov 2013 14:47:02 +0000 Jonti Posted By: renewablejohnJust be careful with UU. There very likely to allow two meters up at the property but will insist that your liable for the supply from the mains meter to the properties. ie addition of 2 property meters should equal the main meter. We had this problem turns out our lovely neighbors either side had tapped into our mains supply. UU insisted each put there own feed pipe direct into the main (over 400mtrs) with separate meters.

But the situation will not worsen to now as they are responsible for the line after the meter anyway.

Jonti]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190156#Comment_190156 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190156#Comment_190156 Tue, 26 Nov 2013 11:45:20 +0000 barge17 Also, does that mean the 3 of you have separate accounts at UU ?

I assume that one of you is still responsible for leaks on the main, so does that mean UU are happy to regularly read all 4 meters? I don't suppose AMR meters can be installed underground near a public road.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190162#Comment_190162 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190162#Comment_190162 Tue, 26 Nov 2013 12:17:28 +0000 windy lamb The neighbours were (eventually) more than happy because the new pipe was much bigger dia. and meant that they didn't loose their shower when our cattle were drinking!]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190187#Comment_190187 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190187#Comment_190187 Tue, 26 Nov 2013 13:59:53 +0000 renewablejohn Posted By: barge17Thanks again for helpful replies. So, renewableJohn, have I got it right that now you have three individual meters at the properties and one at the start of your main?
Also, does that mean the 3 of you have separate accounts at UU ?

I assume that one of you is still responsible for leaks on the main, so does that mean UU are happy to regularly read all 4 meters? I don't suppose AMR meters can be installed underground near a public road.

I am now the only user of the pipe from the main to the house with a meter at the main and a meter at the house approx 600 mtrs. Only responsible for the water from the house meter into the house. The section from the mains to the house is like a sieve and I have agreed for it to be turned off at the mains as we have our own independent water supply due to our concerns of 100 mtrs of lead pipe potentially affecting the health of the kids. The two neighbors each had to install meters at the mains and 400 mtrs of water pipe for there independent water supply. I presume they now get there own bills and we no longer get a bill from UU.]]> http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190534#Comment_190534 http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/newforum/comments.php?DiscussionID=11451&Focus=190534#Comment_190534 Sat, 30 Nov 2013 12:14:38 +0000 barge17
He also said they have a small battery in them, don't need a mains supply, and can be read remotely even when underground. So that's all good news so far.]]>