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Housing - Renovation: Sourcing 'proper triple glazed' uPVC windows

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  1.  
    I am trying to find someone to supply (and fit?) uPVC 3G windows in England.I want a section capable of taking a minimum 48mm unit, not a frame designed for double-glazing into which, with a smaller beading, a 'pinched' 3G unit (of 36mm max, according to one supplier) can be squeezed.

    Can anyone point me in the right direction? (Note I would not choose uPVC, but the client does).

    Thanks!
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2020 edited
     
    Nick Parsons asked: "Can anyone point me in the right direction?"

    Maybe
    https://www.rehau.com/uk-en/rehau-upvc-windows
    and
    https://www.rehau.com/uk-en/find-installer-homeowners
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2020
     
    Velfac, Internorm, 3g is majority product and dg is at a premium, better ironmongery too

    I went insulated ali clad wood 3g
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2020
     
    Do Velfac do UPVC?
  5.  
    rehau GENEO & GENEO ALUTOP will go up to 53mm units

    sorry i dont know any fabricators that build that range.

    Rehau Total70 will do up to 44mm but beads a bit of a nightmare
    komerline do a profile thatll take 42mm with and easy bead to fit.

    I used these a lot but as you said thats not what you're after.
    • CommentAuthorjamesingram
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2020 edited
     
    there was a Scottish fabricator that used to post here on GBF years back that mentioned the GENEO as the only quality 3G pvc window.
    I've no idea if this is them, but it popped up on googley ??

    http://www.qualitytradewindows.co.uk/geneo-window-systems/rehau-geneo-windows/
  7.  
    We had Rehau Geneo triple glazed windows and doors fitted in our new build eight years ago. They were manufactured and fitted by Solent Glass and Glazing.
  8.  
    Thanks everyone!

    I knew they existed but I guess my error was to start by asking suppliers of 2G if they knew where I could get 3G.

    I'll try and chase these up.

    James, do you have any U value details for the 42 or 44mm 'shoe-horned' units? (Uw if you have it).

    Thanks!
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2020
     
    Direct quote from the supplier of 3G UPVC

    'Rehau product site a bit out of date and unwieldy but 70mm [rehau thermo] casements can be 44mm triple glazed to achieve a combined window uValue 0.8W/m2K but no manufacturer’s certificate available'
  10.  
    Thanks again, all! I think I'll follow up the 70mm Rehau and the shoe-horn 44mm option! I get the impression that the price for 'proper 3G frames' is on a very steep ramp above the standard, though I may be wrong.
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2020
     
    Another name that might be worth a mention is Munster. They do TG uPVC windows and their PassiV range includes models with a uPVC core with aluminium on the outside and timber on the inside; 52 mm TG and apparently PHI certified.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020
     
    As I said before in Central Europe 3g is now standard and the volume product,our suppliers are very reactionary are lagging behind badly and doing us no good.

    I saw a contractor offer my local Uni new build 3g as a no cost option vs uk dg that had been specified just over 10 years ago now.

    I would never use uPVC preferring wood, small extra cost but cost over lifetime of building is less
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020
     
    Posted By: tonyI would never use uPVC preferring wood

    Me too, but Nick's customer is setting the requirement.
  14.  
    Yes, as djh says, me too! I confess to having installed 2 uPVC windows in my own house (in 1996) but I would never do so again!
    • CommentAuthorIan1961
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020 edited
     
    Posted By: Nick ParsonsI think I'll follow up the 70mm Rehau


    3 years ago I used 70mm Rehau frames with 44mm 3G glazing units on a new-build.

    The info below for the glass spec needed to achieve an overall 0.82 U value below came from Rehau's technical department (but personally I ended up using a slightly different spec).
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020
     
    The only living-memory job where the customer insisted on PVC, was a complete pain. Yes it was a bit complex, units together in 'window wall', sloping heads, 'bay' corner etc. My usual Russell Timbertech would have handled it, but the chosen PVC firm waited till a week before delivery to say the boss decided 'too complicated'. Then 6wks delay finding alternative co; windows arrived slightly wrong sized so all sorts of packers needed, shaved edges needed too but not poss in PVC. Massive labour intensive effort to make it look OK, client paying for that. And flimsy - the whole thing shudders when the door slams, tho usually it jams.

    Don't do it unless it's strictly rectangular hole-in-wall.
  17.  
    Thanks Ian 1961 and FT. I'd be happy with that Uw in the pdf. I have asked Rehau if they can tell me who they are supplying the section to within 50 miles of me (I want S & F). All those I have asked so far suggest a max unit of 36mm. FT, it's a bog-standard 1950s semi, no bay, strictly rectangular, and all the exg windows are old uPVC. The client likes the 'no paint' bit (although in my experience that means they just look grubby all the time!)
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020
     
    It does not have to be uPVC to be no paint
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020
     
    Posted By: Nick ParsonsThe client likes the 'no paint' bit

    That's why I bought powder-coated ali on a timber frame. :bigsmile:
    • CommentAuthorHollyBush
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2020
     
    Posted By: Nick ParsonsThanks Ian 1961 and FT. I'd be happy with that Uw in the pdf. I have asked Rehau if they can tell me who they are supplying the section to within 50 miles of me (I want S & F). All those I have asked so far suggest a max unit of 36mm. FT, it's a bog-standard 1950s semi, no bay, strictly rectangular, and all the exg windows are old uPVC. The client likes the 'no paint' bit (although in my experience that means they just look grubby all the time!)


    I called Rehau direct in Manchester, the rep was very helpful and put me in touch with suppliers able and very willing to get the right bead, frame and glass
  21.  
    one issue with the 44mm Rehau is the beads are a pain to get in especially in the small vents.
    I've popped a few over the years and its very annoying !
    Wet them up well and remove the gaffa tape.
  22.  
    Thanks Tony for the point re non-paint. I don't think I am going to wean him off uPVC, even though it's definitely not my choice. Hollybush and Jamesingram, thanks for the info. Much appreciated.
    • CommentAuthorjms452
    • CommentTimeAug 20th 2020
     
    Posted By: jamesingramone issue with the 44mm Rehau is the beads are a pain to get in especially in the small vents.
    I've popped a few over the years and its very annoying !
    Wet them up well and remove the gaffa tape.


    Last time I fitted 3G with a 44mm compatible rehau bead (a couple of months ago) the window co had started adding partial cutaways to the inside of the beads which made it massively easier.
  24.  
    Posted By: djh
    Posted By: Nick ParsonsThe client likes the 'no paint' bit

    That's why I bought powder-coated ali on a timber frame.

    Posted By: Nick ParsonsI don't think I am going to wean him off uPVC

    Hmm - powder-coated ali on a timber frame vs. uPVC - there might be a cost difference that could be a factor!
  25.  
    Thanks jms452. That's useful to know. P-in-H, yes, probaby different leagues price-wise, particularly as the Rehau 44mm option is installed within a cheap, widely-available 'DG' frame.
    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeAug 20th 2020
     
    One thing to beware of is the incredibly poor quality of the ironmongery used, it often fails in dg and 3g will be 50% heavier
    •  
      CommentAuthordjh
    • CommentTimeAug 20th 2020
     
    The hardware choice is down to Nick, the installer and the customer. Rehau don't supply it.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDamonHD
    • CommentTimeAug 23rd 2020 edited
     
    I don't know if I'm too late to the party, but my uPVC 3G was by Whiteline:

    http://www.earth.org.uk/triple-glazing-3G.html

    https://www.whiteline.co.uk/windows/pvc-windows/triple-glazing/

    Rgds

    Damon
    •  
      CommentAuthorfostertom
    • CommentTimeAug 24th 2020
     
    That's it! I was trying to remember a make that's significantly different from all the rest - Whiteline it is. Can't remember exactly why I was so impressed at the time. Sadly we had to choose the cheapest instead (i.e. for the contract, on behalf of the client).
  30.  
    Thanks very much Damon. Sorry for the delayed reply, but I haven't 'looked in' for a day or two. I'll give them a try. Still waiting to hear from Rehau. I will chase.

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