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Green Building Bible, Fourth Edition
Green Building Bible, fourth edition (both books)
These two books are the perfect starting place to help you get to grips with one of the most vitally important aspects of our society - our homes and living environment.

PLEASE NOTE: A download link for Volume 1 will be sent to you by email and Volume 2 will be sent to you by post as a book.

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    • CommentAuthortony
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2011
     
    Is this news? replacement windows are at the bottom of my list of things to do to save energy and one of the least cost effective things to do

    Solar panels should produce a nice turn of profit due to FITs, but miss sold can be and sometimes are disastrous.

    Why didn't they ask us we could have given them the low down
    • CommentAuthorcrusoe
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2011
     
    You don't say which kind of solar. PV I wouldn't know. But low savings from solar thermal is very believable. When 'Which' came out with their own research in 2010 - ie £75 PA typical saving from solar hot water (not including any grants under the RHI), not many in the solar industry wanted to believe it.

    Mis-sold tony? Mostly are IMO. Why? Because at present approved training courses teach plumbers only to produce these feeble savings, when we could do so much better. Ask several members of this forum who have their oversize arrays tapped into thermal stores.

    Do you have a link to the report in question please?
  1.  
    "replacement windows are at the bottom of my list of things to do to save energy and one of the least cost effective things to do"
    Why go for super expensive Uw<1.0 Wmk then ?
    I just got 11 windows and 1 door , 1 set of french doors , Uw 1.3 UPVC, for customer , £3000 supplied, doesn't seem that expensive
    Yes I agree , dont get them from the likes of 'you know who' for £15K+
    I presumed windows were one of the bigger offenders in a home when it come to heatloss through the fabric and draughts.
    changing from sinlge glazing to well insulated windows must give a relative good energy saving to cost
    • CommentAuthorCrofty
    • CommentTimeSep 20th 2011 edited
     
    If my SAP worksheet is anything to go buy windows are certainly a big offender....60m2 of glazing with a U of 1.8 Wmk loses more heat than 400m2 of wall (0.19) and roof (0.1)!

    I'm in the process of having the SAP re-done to consider better windows...not sure if the cost/benefit will justify windows better than 1.4-1.5 as an average?
    • CommentAuthorGavin_A
    • CommentTimeSep 21st 2011
     
    which report?

    and when it says bottom, is it just saying that people should sort their loft insulation, cavity wall, energy efficient lightbulbs etc out first? In which case that's just basic advice being regurgitated in report format.
    •  
      CommentAuthorJSHarris
    • CommentTimeSep 21st 2011
     
    You can juggle the figures around to show pretty much anything, depending on the newsworthy slant or political bias you want to impart to the report.

    Using cost effectiveness of energy saving measures as a baseline puts windows fairly well down the list, simply because any replacement windows, good or bad, will be a high capital cost item.

    Using total household energy loss as the baseline moves good double, or triple, glazed windows well up the list, simply because they are a major source of heat loss for most homes.

    We're fond of always trying to look at energy saving in terms of return on capital investment, whereas I believe we should start from a position of always looking to minimise energy wastage, and use that as the yardstick for comparison.

    I fully accept that refurbishment of existing housing stock is going to need greater compromise when it comes to reducing energy loss, than, for example a new build. Windows are a good case. The incremental additional cost of fitting super-insulated 3G windows over bog standard 2G in a new build is modest, with a shorter pay-back time from the initial investment than that from replacing serviceable existing windows in old housing stock. It doesn't alter the fact that poor windows are a major source of heat loss and wasted energy, though, and that, after all, is the most significant issue for the future.
    • CommentAuthorJoiner
    • CommentTimeSep 21st 2011
     
    In my experience, the majority of people upgrading their window glazing are primarily concerned with the subjective improvements in comfort levels rather than any expected saving in fuel bills, which are usually considered a bonus.

    Expectations of exagerrated cost savings have always been the stock-in-trade of the upvc boys.

    I'm saddened to see that they're now being matched by a lot of timber guys forced to adopt the same marketing tactics, with the added kudos of being "greener" of course.

    As for pv? What did we expect? http://www.greenbuildingforum.co.uk/forum114/comments.php?DiscussionID=7537
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