I am hopeing to have an extension to my property in the near future. Due to this I employed a professional chartered surveyor as a kind of part time advisor / project manager, more than anything for basic support as I am all alone with the project. I have planning permission for this work, a proposed bathroom / utility area, which currently has a small loft room above the adjoining sitting room. I wish to make use of this loft as a small bedroom but the head room is somewhat low. The surveyor originally suggested that the ridge height be raised ( very minimally ) to allow for more height. As this alteration is barely visible compared with the original drawing, and, also as this old cottage is completely isolated standing totally by itself among far reaching fields and hills. ( over a mile off track from the nearest road ) The surveyor told me that I needn't worry about obtaining planning
permission for the slightly raised ridge height. He stated that it is doubtful that any official would even ever notice or even if they did, bother to make a fuss if they were to discover it.

He drew a basic revised drawing showing the new ridgeheight requirement for me to give to builders. He also stated that if the worst came to the worst, and someone did spot the revised ridgeheight that I could always file for retrospective planning and that therefore there was nothing to worry about.

Now several weeks later, He states that this work cannot go ahead without getting a S73. Which I am now told will cost well over £1000.00 and will mean that an architect will need to re -draw up the plans. Originally, this surveyor told me that the slight alterations I had wanted to the plans should cost no more than £150.00 to re - submit through planning ( if needed. ) and that he himself would draw up the revision. I am REALLY struggling with cash complications so my budget for the build is already restricted and a burden.

What should I do ? Do I go ahead regardless and ask the builders to make the spec to the ridge height higher than originally drawn up ,without planning consent ? or do I lose the opportunity for a useable loft room and have the build exactly as drawn up on the original plans, because of a mere technicality ?

The surveyor has already submitted the plans to the archtect who originally drew them up
and he earlier approached the planning office regards alteration works to another part of the property at a future date.
( IF, I can ever afford to have these extra works done ) so they now know about the proposed change.

I VERY MUCH need to know the amount of risk I would be taking if I go ahead with the higher ridge height as I am
deeply worried at the possibility that some official or other might, out of sheer spite, ( could not be for any other reason ) order the extension be demolished and rebuilt for the matter of a very slight variation in height which will make absolutely no difference to anyone other than myself. Any professional advice would be very much appreciated and is needed ASAP please !

I believe S73 was a formal way of ammending PP. I thought it had been done away with. I read there was a consultation about bringing it back.

Anyway we got our plans ammended by simply writing to the planners and asking if we could ammend them. They told us to send in multiple copies of ammended drawings and they wrote us a letter accepting them together with a stamped copy for the files.

How much higher do you need to make the ridge?

An extra 150mm is likely to be no problem and might be possible without PP under permitted development. More than that and it would be wise to check with planning. They may well just waive it through.

Hi,
is it a planning issue or a building regulations issue. The room will become habitable if you declare it as a bedroom instead of a loft and thus come under the building regs. Also for example there might be issues with access from the room below.
Cheers
Mike up north

Posted By: Mike (Up North)Hi,
is it a planning issue or a building regulations issue. The room will become habitable if you declare it as a bedroom instead of a loft and thus come under the building regs. Also for example there might be issues with access from the room below.
Cheers
Mike up north

Will be both.

Thank you, people, for your comments. CWatters, I understand that the revised ridge height is 50 - 60 cm higher than the one specified on the plans. There will also, additionally, be a couple of velux windows put in for light, which, again, are not specified in the original plans.

RobinB, you were most fortunate to have such friendly and helpful planning people. I will admit,
I hate the idea of approaching anyone for a favour, as I simply fear I will not get it. I am not exactly what you might call the luckiest of individuals ... Mike, I appreciate, what you say about the distinction between declaring as a bedroom or loft. As I was simply planning on using a sleeping bag up there anyway ( I don't much like beds in general ! ) this would hardly constitute a bedroom . I aim to store a lot of of stuff up there also so it will certainly be more of a storage loft than anything else.

Mike George, thank you for taking the trouble to supply a link for me. I have read its contents and, hopefully, it should come in useful. Ali, regarding your comment, I do so hope, it is not as you say, that my advisor is trying to rook me ! He appears to be so nice and genuine, yet I must confess to having had rather more than my fair share of people taking advantage of me, so who knows

I really have to digress at this point, Robin, You've got me wondering now about that idiom - " from the horses mouth " so I looked it up and apparently ( much to my surprise ) it is a modern phrase to do with horseracing and tipsters. The horse itself being even more knowledgable of its ' form', than stable lads, trainers etc. Personally, my own version would have placed this phrase way back in intiquity. As the horse is such a wonder and inspiration, such a noble and tremendously powerful symbol of freedom, and there is nothing more knowing, more spiritually adroit, more sagacious, than the truly free ......

Better then to listen more often to horses, and less to the folly of man ....

Except of course when taking heed of the special individuals who are giving advice on the Green forum !

Dominic, Delighted with your comments, there is hope yet ! I am most interested in the idea of an NMA. Exactly, how do I go about sending in an applicaion for this ? Do I need a special form for this ? Who do I apply to ? I am none too good dealing with official stuff, so please spoonfeed me with the procedure, slow, infant style ..

I like the sound of Flush fitting conservation rooflights, but would they cost more than Velux ? I don't really like to chop and change things too much, as the builders have already quoted for the cost and fitting of the Velux now. Also, although, naturally, I want the very best standard of materials possible. I really do need to keep to as strict a budget as the build allows, so no extra frills.

Ref - The £1000.00 by the looks of the letter, that is only an installment . Looks like it would be more like a couple of thousand or so as the architect seems to want to draw up everything again. Which really does not seem at all necessary. As the plans are already fully detailed and were drawn up and passed ages ago. There is no extreme variation from the original. I have to say, I was pretty surprised and shocked when I received the letter.

Example of notice to be served on part owners [as applicable] http://www.redcar-cleveland.gov.uk/main.nsf/0FE16738FCDC6D44802573F50040A9CC/$FILE/Notice_No_1.pdf

Thank you, Mike George, you are a font full of information for which I am most greatful. I am wondering about the possibility of perhaps approaching another architect to do the work for me. Would this be appropriate ?

One thing , however, is that the local plannng people have already been approached by the surveyor whom I asked to deal with the matter for me. He told me it is they that have made these rather excessive demands. ( the surveyor originally told me the revisions should cost no more than £150.00 to pass through planning ) I am not sure if the architect has yet been in contact with the authorities that be, or not, regards this proposal, nor how well he knows them personally. What really worries me now is that planning might already by now have made their mind up not to be particularly obliging. After all, planning officials are ordinary human beings, same as most people, and in particular in a small welsh town such as the one I am adjacent to, people get very cliquey.

I on the otherhand am a total outsider, living in the middle of nowhere. I do not even have any friends locally to back me up, so it is difficult, and infact pretty alien to me doing all this official stuff. I am here for a quiet life, to seek inspiration from the beauty of nature which surrounds. To grow my own vegetables, to chop my own wood, and to dream my own dreams at night time beneath a multude of vivid stars.....So to get all tangled up with the various authorities involved, is way out of my comfort zone.....

A silly question for you Storm,

What is a 'slight variation'? How high was the loft room originally, and how high do you plan it to be? What is the size of the loft room? Is it a double pitch roof out over the extension?

It's an old adage in building - changing your mind always costs money. It pays to really understand what you want to do and how you're going to do it before you get stuck in. Not that that helps ignorant self builders like us - we have to bumble our way through the works, finding out the better way of doing things half way through each part of the project.

Tuna, I have no idea of the measurements of the loft. In the three years or so I have lived here I have never set foot up there ! The loft hatch is very small. The proposal incidently will be for a single pitch roof. Works have not as yet started on the property and I have not been in contact with any building control officer.

Ali , It was most certainly my expectation ( our expectation, whilst my step-father was alive ) to have the roof replaced. My Step-father applied for planning for an extension to both sides of the property. One side, a very manky bathroom / utility, to be replaced by an entirely new build. This is the side to be raised slightly, in height .
The other extension, (East of the property ) was originally intended to be a downstairs library, with a bedroom with ensuite bathroom above for my stepfather's use. As he is no longer here I have revised ideas for this side with the intention of having a large loft studio upstairs ( exactly same ridge height but with much cheaper velux windows instead of the frightfully expensive dormer windows as originally drawn into the plans, and a spiral staircase, leading up from the library to the loft, instead of the expensive solid staircase designed on the existing plans as wished for by my step-father.

I am more than a little hesitant to post the application number and reveal the council involved. This would mean exposing the architect and the planning officials involved, which simply is not the appropriate thing to do. Not that I could upload anything, anyway ! I have tried hard in the past to post in photo's of the property but they just won't upload.

The original planning application and building regs etc was fully passed over a year ago I would say. That means there is full planning permission for an extension to both sides of the property. I could, if you wish, copy and paste portions of the letter that I have recently received from the architect. ( when I can gain proper access to my email,it has gone on the blink at the moment ! ) To my mind the procedure seems to be very convaluted, proposing to redraw the entire thing from scratch. Which would mean basically paying all over again, what my step-father has already paid for. Surely such an extensive amount of work should not be required ?

Maren, Thank you so much for your comments, it is interesting to learn of your own experiences. Though I quite suspect these folk/ councils are a law unto themselves. The final decision resting, no doubt, with the particular individuals concerned. The planning officers or building control officer's personal opinion / predilection, is the only real decider. Who can argue with this ? Such is the way of things in this cockeyed reality of a world....... I will do as you say, however, and will leap ( pole-vault at the ready ! ) across my giant of a shadow. Love the expression bye the way. A new one on me, and leaves much to ponder upon ....

No way have I ever contemplated the idea of moving on, Robin, Has anything I have said suggested otherwise ?
It would simply be far more preferable that the cottage was more habitable from the outset. However, I am where I wish to be and have no intention whatsoever of leaving. Yes, building works and all that such entails is stressful but then nothing is perfect in this world. Life is a mammoth struggle in one form or another where ever one might choose to live. My experience anyway, that's the way of things ....